Out Of Hand

[brynmr]

I'm thinking of doing this one in colored pencil. Uncertain about it conceptually.

[Rose]

Tommy,

You definitely come up with interesting compositions! What feeling are you trying to convey with this one? What are the colors you are thinking about? Just curious. :D

[brynmr]

Don't know on the color Rose. Originally thought of sunlit with cool shadows bright blue sky.

Feeling: Soft gentle erotic I guess.

[Rose]

I like that a lot... her legs look strong, like the mighty trees around her, she is a woman of confidence, yet erotic. You used negative space, and that's an eye catcher. So, is this beauty blonde or brunette?? ;)

[brynmr]

A blonde. One of several characters I developed a few years ago. I want to do one of them but not sure which. This one will need some more reference cause I'll want more info for the landscape.

What guys think: women always feed birds naked LOL. :rolleyes:

[glo]

Originally thought of sunlit with cool shadows bright blue sky
I guess even though this is in the graphite section your thinking of adding color? The first one is my choice, but I guess the large trees are symbols of masculinity? :blushing: I'll not go further on that. LOL

Of the 3 pieces I have seen you do, this one definetly has a video game like style. Is that what you were going for? Although you have it in the graphite section I'd love to see the woodland in color.
Gloria

[brynmr]

I've decided not to pursue this subject further. I'll stick this into a folder and get on to other things. Thanks for your feedback Rose and Glo. :)

[Greg]

Hey Tommy. Hope you reconsider. This seems to have a lot of possibilities.

[MickeyG]

Please don't stop working on this one...I love the look of it and am really interested in seeing it developed further. Pweeeeaaase?;)

[brynmr]

Please don't stop working on this one...I love the look of it and am really interested in seeing it developed further. Pweeeeaaase?;)

Boy, you guys are so encouraging. Promise I'll post here if I do.
:)

[brynmr]

Last week I posted an image of two girls about to engage in a kiss here in this thread. They were nude and an appropriate icon was in place as you know. Bill C deleted this post containing the image. He informed me that this went beyond nudity to erotic art. Not giving it too much thought I apologized and that was that. Since then I've read the rules and apparently no violation was made on my part.

"Works displaying sexual activities ARE permitted, provided the art is tasteful, and does not illustrate the perspective of physical penetration."

I would appreciate an apology from Bill C and I suggest he read the rules. If he has found my image to be pornographic (which is isn't) I would like a full explanation so we can debate this. I don't appreciate being censored. No one does.

Thank you.

Tommy

[Rose]

Tommy,

I have enjoyed all of your work and I think it has all been very tasteful and not offensive to anyone. I would love to see another WIP. :-)

[Gemma]

Last week I posted an image of two girls about to engage in a kiss here in this thread. They were nude and an appropriate icon was in place as you know. Bill C deleted this post containing the image. He informed me that this went beyond nudity to erotic art. Not giving it too much thought I apologized and that was that. Since then I've read the rules and apparently no violation was made on my part.

"Works displaying sexual activities ARE permitted, provided the art is tasteful, and does not illustrate the perspective of physical penetration."

I would appreciate an apology from Bill C and I suggest he read the rules. If he has found my image to be pornographic (which is isn't) I would like a full explanation so we can debate this. I don't appreciate being censored. No one does.

Thank you.

Tommy

Tommy,

Bill had gotten a few complaints, privately, about your thread. When this happens our policy is to pull the thread and put it in a holding area so we as a team can look at it and decide if it is adhearing to our rules. During the time Bill had gotten the complaints we were all at CPSA convention and having problems with the internet connection we had at the hotel. Bill's intention was to move the post in question to review but it seemed to get lost in cyber land somewhere or just simply deleted. The reason I am answering for Bill right now is that he is not available all day and I didn't want you to think you were being ignored. If you would like, please send me your attachment and we will handle this issue. Bill was just simply trying to do what he was suppose to be doing by moving it and it accidently got deleted instead. In the future I would appreciate it if you have a complaint with one of our volunteers/moderators (I want to emphasize the word volunteer) please send either Arlene or I a PM rather than complaining publicly.

Gemma and Arlene

[Angela]

Tommy,

There you go again, using my body as a model . . I am expecting payment soon. As I said before, cash, check or M/O. I'll take any of those! You should definitely work on this . . . i believe it has real potential. And listen to Rose talking about negative space - good for you girl! You're really learning!

Tommy, as for the deleted post, I read the other post in site discussions and I just hope that you don't feel too upset by it to stop posting. I don't have an opinion on the subject either way, but I know you were upset. Your work is lovely and I look forward to seeing more.

[Rose]

Angela... thanks for the compliment. I also would like to continue to see more of Tommy's work. You have a great body Angela! :-)

[brynmr]

So that was you posing for these drawings Angela? I don't know how I missed that. Check's in the mail. :) Here's the deleted (now approved) image of the other one I was considering doing up in colored pencil. I wonder if CPSA has a category for these LOL. New Mexico here I come. ;)

[Rose]

Tommy,

I like the composition! I would like to see color on the leaves, well, even some pastels all over. So THIS is the forbidden image... well, I think you did a great job. You definitely have a career in erotic art.. :-) But you already knew that! Angela... wow.. maybe you should move to Mexico. You could both get rich.

Seriously, DOES CPSA have a category for erotic art?? Like the portrait that someone linked to of "Genesis"... where would that fit in? Hm...

BTW, is there a title for this. It appeared at first glance that the girl on the right was on a cloud, but then i saw grass. Splain it to me! :rolleyes:

[brynmr]

The title is "Kiss" Rose. The girl on the left is standing in a bit of water and the girl on the right is resting on a log that would be attached to something to the right. Having lived in British Columbia I saw this log arrangment occassionally.

And yeah I'm pretty curious about the categories too. I'll ask someone I know who should know and get back to you. There's an international exhibition next year in New Mexico Rose. I'm going to enter my Abby piece.

[Angela]

Rose, if only I did look like that . . . hmmmm. . . I'd move to L.A.!

I love this Tommy. I love the way the reflections of the sun land on the figures through the leaves. This will be a stunning piece when it's done - your work is exceptional and I would love to see this one "Kiss" from the beginning!

[Rose]

The title is "Kiss" Rose. The girl on the left is standing in a bit of water and the girl on the right is resting on a log that would be attached to something to the right. Having lived in British Columbia I saw this log arrangment occassionally.

And yeah I'm pretty curious about the categories too. I'll ask someone I know who should know and get back to you. There's an international exhibition next year in New Mexico Rose. I'm going to enter my Abby piece.

The title is apropos! I think you have it in if you enter the Abby piece. It's just demanding a prize!!

[Cleo]

I don't think the second piece has the impact of the first ....sorry. :o

I think the first piece is great !




Cleo

[Angela]

Here's a couple of questions I don't know why I didn't ask you before!!

Where do you get your ideas? Do you actually use a model? Your women are so beautiful and I love the way they look!!

[Rose]

Here's a couple of questions I don't know why I didn't ask you before!!

Where do you get your ideas? Do you actually use a model? Your women are so beautiful and I love the way they look!!


Angela ;-) comeon, they're you!!! Remember??? LOL

[Angela]

Shhh. . . I don't want EVERYONE to know that!!

[Rose]

Shhh. . . I don't want EVERYONE to know that!!

Our secret.... ;)

[brynmr]

Angela ;-) comeon, they're you!!! Remember??? LOL

LOLOL

[brynmr]

Here's a couple of questions I don't know why I didn't ask you before!!

Where do you get your ideas? Do you actually use a model? Your women are so beautiful and I love the way they look!!

The ideas just come into my head all in one piece Angela. They're quite simple really. The idea comes up and then I have to feel it and imagine the logistics of the scene. I put myself in the place of the characters and feel it. Sometimes it doesn't work.

After I've loosely sketched out the idea I then refine it by referring to pictures of women; using their body parts. It's frustrating because it would be soooo easy if I had a model next door I could just ask to pose occassionally. So I piece them together. Some of the figure comes from my head. Some of it I know and is easy. The hands are almost always mine. I use a mirror.

Thanks for the input Cleo. :)

[Toni]

Seriously, DOES CPSA have a category for erotic art??

Seriously... no.

All CPSA entries are judged together. One catagory. There is nothing to define erotic art from still life or something abstract. Each piece rests on it's own merits. Your allowed two slides to jury in, but only one can be accepted.

TJ

[brynmr]

Seriously... no.

All CPSA entries are judged together. One catagory. There is nothing to define erotic art from still life or something abstract. Each piece rests on it's own merits. Your allowed two slides to jury in, but only one can be accepted.

TJ

Thanks Toni. Don't they have a fantasy category?

[Toni]

Thanks Toni. Don't they have a fantasy category?

yw & nope, no catagories at all.

TJ

[sassybird]

I think it's well drawn for an illustrative look. Very much something that
one would see in Playboy or Hustler. Personally I think these images do
nothing to enhance the status of women and instead perpetrate the idea of
women with perfect booby jobs.

[Brenda]

Good points, Sass!

I guess what offends me so much about "The Kiss", "Out of Hand" and "Bedtime Reading" is that these are examples of false images of women. Women face so much pressure from the media: magazines, movies, television, etc. to have a perfect body. Unfortunately it is a body that only starvation and surgical implants can acheive.

These very well drawn illustrations are ones adolescent boys and men with adolescent minds should love.

Having said that, Tommy, your linework just amazes me. It is sure and simple but those simple lines acheive so much depth. I greatly admire your skill with a pencil.

[brynmr]

These very well drawn illustrations are ones adolescent boys and men with adolescent minds should love.


And thank goodness for that. I love the child in me as I love the adolescent. These are all parts of me and sometimes I let them express themselves. I don't imagine I'd offend anyone if I drew women from a child's point of view. Wonder why. The mind that belittles these expressions is the tyrant. That's one thing I don't want to be or express.

It's so easy to find things to hate in this world isn't it?

Btw I loved Playboy magazine growing up. Those women were so beautiful. :clap:

[glo]

Brynmr,

I guess I echo some of what's already been said. Your Abby piece is wonderfull and should be sent in to the CPSA. The first nude piece I saw of yours was the half nude sketch of the woman in jeans. (Can't remember the title.) Which I very much liked. Real verses illistration wins anyday in my book. A beautiful body, done beautifully is just that. Your skills on real life models are in my opinion your best work. You should do more of that.

And since I believe all human bodies are works of art, you would have many more female groupies if you added more real women to your portfolio. And maybe a few beautifully done men. LOL :D
Gloria

[brynmr]

Gloria these drawings are fantasy drawings. They were never intended to be real women.

[brynmr]

Brynmr,

And since I believe all human bodies are works of art, you would have many more female groupies if you added more real women to your portfolio. And maybe a few beautifully done men. LOL :D
Gloria

Like this idea but men?......... nope. :D

[glo]

Ah, come on now. We need eye candy to.... I mean....... :blushing: art.
Gloria

[brynmr]

Speaking of which if I see another Degas or a Monet I think I'm going to be sick. For some reason these guys at the National Gallery of Canada here in Ottawa seem to want to force-feed us this European stuff ad nauseam. :bangin:

[larsnip]

While I find very little redeeming quality in these drawings, that in itself does not warrant comment.
What does warrant comment is the lack of respect of others opinions and sensibilities in this and other threads dealing with it.
When complaints are lodged one should be adult enough to post there work elsewhere, where its more appropriate, not act as though they have the "right" to post their work where ever they wish contray to anyone elses wishes.When we grow up we learn to put limitations on ourselves, maybe your "Tyrant" is really good old common sense, and you should listen to it.
The way some womens opinions and comments have been handled and the lack of respect for those comments only leads one to come to the conclusion that the perceived values put forth in the drawings are the same values that were intended.
If this is what the Scribble talk management wants to condone so be it, but lets call a spade, a spade. This is the caliber of Playboy cartoons and that is also the spirit in which it is intended.
Serious art it is not

[Denise]

While I find very little redeeming quality in these drawings, that in itself does not warrant comment.
What does warrant comment is the lack of respect of others opinions and sensibilities in this and other threads dealing with it.
When complaints are lodged one should be adult enough to post there work elsewhere, where its more appropriate, not act as though they have the "right" to post their work where ever they wish contray to anyone elses wishes.When we grow up we learn to put limitations on ourselves, maybe your "Tyrant" is really good old common sense, and you should listen to it.
The way some womens opinions and comments have been handled and the lack of respect for those comments only leads one to come to the conclusion that the perceived values put forth in the drawings are the same values that were intended.
If this is what the Scribble talk management wants to condone so be it, but lets call a spade, a spade. This is the caliber of Playboy cartoons and that is also the spirit in which it is intended.
Serious art it is not

I guess what offends me so much about "The Kiss", "Out of Hand" and "Bedtime Reading" is that these are examples of false images of women. Women face so much pressure from the media: magazines, movies, television, etc. to have a perfect body. Unfortunately it is a body that only starvation and surgical implants can acheive.

These very well drawn illustrations are ones adolescent boys and men with adolescent minds should love.

Having said that, Tommy, your linework just amazes me. It is sure and simple but those simple lines acheive so much depth. I greatly admire your skill with a pencil.

I think it's well drawn for an illustrative look. Very much something that
one would see in Playboy or Hustler. Personally I think these images do
nothing to enhance the status of women and instead perpetrate the idea of
women with perfect booby jobs.


I very much agree w/ what's already been stated. Having said that, I do appreciate your artistic talent, Tommy. Abby's portrait is outstanding. It's obvious you have great skill. I'm saddened at the direction you're taking it.

[Toni]

**Puts on Modorator Hat**.... I'd like to take a minute to step in here and say this thread is appropriately named.. but lets not let it get out of hand for real ok? Personal attacks are not allowed. Tommy has posted these images per our user agreement. Not everyones art will please us all. You have the choice to open this thread or not, please do so.

**removes modorator hat**

that aside, tommy your linework is very stylized and illustrative in these two pieces. They appear to be fun and fantasized. Adding color would only add to the impact.

TJ

[brynmr]

Thank you Toni. :)

[Arlene]

Those women were so beautiful. :clap:Of course they were. Makeup for a photo shoot, and then airbrushing (nowadays photoshop) can do wonders to enhance just about any woman.

I'm not saying they're not beautiful, but Jamie Lee Curtis went around the country about a year or two ago, showing how women are enhanced to be even more then they are.

If this is what the Scribble talk management wants to condone so be it Just because we allow it based on our user agreement, doesn't mean we like the subject or the way the art is drawn.

In this case they are well drawn cartoonish illustrations.

[brynmr]

Of course they were. Makeup for a photo shoot, and then airbrushing (nowadays photoshop) can do wonders to enhance just about any woman.

I'm not saying they're not beautiful, but Jamie Lee Curtis went around the country about a year or two ago, showing how women are enhanced to be even more then they are.

I think all the airbrushing of women nowadays is quite unattractive. Way too heavy handed. Crude even. I find myself doing visual corrections. LOL

[Rose]

If it were just that easy! I'd grab a couple of airbrushes, one for each thigh! :D

[brynmr]

I'm sure you're beautiful just as you are Rose. :)

[Rose]

I'm sure you're beautiful just as you are Rose. :)

Aw shucks! Thanks Tommy! :blushing:

[Angela]

Tommy,

All I can say is that I was very surprised at the direction some comments were going with your drawings. I'm sure you posted to see what people liked about the way you draw and the content itself. I disagree however, if people don't appreciate what you've drawn, that they should even comment about it. If they don't like it, or think it's inappropriate, the little button at the top of the toolbar that says "Back" should be the only button they push. :)

I think your artwork is outstanding. It is an ILLUSTRATION and was meant to be an ILLUSTRATION. I'm a woman and I'm not offended in the least by the way these women were drawn. I love Patrick Nagel - who saw women as works of art and drew them as such. Were people offended by the picture he drew of the two women touching each other's breasts? Probably. But that didn't stop him from being a success. If all art was meant to be realistic, then what the hell was Picasso thinking? If all art was meant to be "serious" then how did the Peanuts Gang become so popular? What one person perceives as art, another person perceives as scribble. I'm sorry but I think that some of the comments were as inappropriate as some of you felt the subjects were. I don't debate well at all, so I'm finished and I hope I didn't offend anyone, but I said what I felt needed to be said.

I would love to continue to see these types of pictures from you Tommy and I hope you continue to post them because you are so talented. Illustration IS art, in my opinion. :D

[brynmr]

Tommy,

All I can say is that I was very surprised at the direction some comments were going with your drawings. I'm sure you posted to see what people liked about the way you draw and the content itself. I disagree however, if people don't appreciate what you've drawn, that they should even comment about it. If they don't like it, or think it's inappropriate, the little button at the top of the toolbar that says "Back" should be the only button they push. :)

I think your artwork is outstanding. It is an ILLUSTRATION and was meant to be an ILLUSTRATION. I'm a woman and I'm not offended in the least by the way these women were drawn. I love Patrick Nagel - who saw women as works of art and drew them as such. Were people offended by the picture he drew of the two women touching each other's breasts? Probably. But that didn't stop him from being a success. If all art was meant to be realistic, then what the hell was Picasso thinking? If all art was meant to be "serious" then how did the Peanuts Gang become so popular? What one person perceives as art, another person perceives as scribble. I'm sorry but I think that some of the comments were as inappropriate as some of you felt the subjects were. I don't debate well at all, so I'm finished and I hope I didn't offend anyone, but I said what I felt needed to be said.

I would love to continue to see these types of pictures from you Tommy and I hope you continue to post them because you are so talented. Illustration IS art, in my opinion. :D


Bravo! :D You said it better than I could Angela and I couldn't agree more! I believe some of the comments were political comments and had nothing to do with the art so mostly I ignored them. I love Nagel's works too. So many. George Petty, Gil Elvgren, William Russell Flint and more. And what about the Ancient Egyptians? Careful consideration and knowledge of art history and less focus on political (& moral) agendas would have fathered entirely different sentiments.

You're right too about illustration being art. There used to be no distinction but snooty people in power probably had something to do with screwing that up.

These drawings were meant to be lighthearted, sweetly erotic creations to please my eyes. They have. To belittle them reveals something of the commentator rather than the art as is always the case.

Thanks for your support Angela. I appreciate it lots. I'll send you a link where you can see more of my babe drawings. :)

[scottb326]

I am actually surprised at the negative comments. I believe the human body is beautiful regardless of how it is drawn. I love the fantasy art of Boris, Frazetta, etc. They are usually drawn from a live human model. These images that Tommy has drawn are not pornographic, and to me, are no different than a Fabio romance novel cover (As far a being degrading). As a male, I have have always been fascinated with the human body. Male or female. As far as how the women are drawn, I think they are great. I am sure most women would like to see a drawing of a Fabio, than a flabio. Even though, it is unfortunate, on how people are perceived nowadays (being thin, etc), I still really appreciate these drawing. When I view Tommy's drawing, I see the wonderful talent he has. :)
-Scott

[brynmr]

Thanks Scott. I'm glad you like them. Frazetta was always one of my art heros.

[MickeyG]

Soooooo...when are we going to see these developed huh??? :D Taps foot impatiently! :annoyed:

[Bob Ebdon]

Just to put in my 2p worth. I don't find these erotic in the slightest. They are fairies without the wings. They are pure fantasy and IMO demean women about as much as a drawing of Gandalf would demean wizards. I like the stylisation of them - they owe something to manga maybe? - and I like the boldness of line. Who am I to judge if they are great art or not?

[celia]

:nudity2: I'm a 65 year old grandmother of 7, and I thoroughly enjoyed seeing your drawings. They show an inate talent and plenty of planning and wonderful execution. They may not appeal to everyone, but what does? I would display them almost anywhere.

I have drawn several nudes during my artistic endeavors, and enjoyed the challenge of the human form. I will post an example. I hope that you don't mind.

Please keep working on your "babes". They are simply adorable.

Celia

[Raquel]

Wow, Tommy, what a stir!!! I won't add to it... I feel uncomfortable, not offended, seeing two women kissing, so I understand how others react the way they do. I doubt I would ever have an image like that where I can see it often.

Are you going to proceed with the first one? I like it better than the second, for the simple reason that all its parts have been carefully designed. Positive and negative forms are beautiful, and have a function within the whole! IMO great design IS art.

So... how far do you intend to take it? I would love to see what you make out of it in CP!

[oozoo]

I definitely felt the need to respond to this...

The drawings are beautifully rendered!! Your use of line and negative space is very Anime-ish, and your grasp of the human form is superb! Bravo!

As for the subject matter...a large part of Art is evoking an emotional reaction, right? Hammer....nail!

[TeAnne]

I like these drawings very much. I see a sense of fun in them.

I don't think I will post my abstract nudes though. :eek: :rolleyes: :blushing: